Well I would say 90-95% of GC's fail.  98% may be pushing it though... and to characterize the entire industry as destined to failure is inaccurate.  I'm not even close to failure, and I have yet to see a center following my guidelines fail.  I'm guessing you were probably one of the hundreds who thought he could actually make it by throwing 20 computers in a room and charging $4+/hour.  Live and learn... better luck next time.

This is a very interesting topic right here in the "GAMER" section of the forums.

Everything has a chance of failure.  You location, environment, location, strategies, capital, dedication, experience, ingenuity  and capital all come into play. Sure you have a greater chance of failure than if you never tried at all, but everything great involves risk.  I can say that all centers that failed did something wrong whether they want to admit it or not.  They chose a bad location, made a bad business deal, got too cheap on certain marketing and threw away too much on others, they had bad partners, were too big-headed even for their own customers, etc.  Most are just plain under-capitalized.

Some would debate that right now is not the best time to open any business, while others here note that gaming centers are cheap entertainment and are somewhat recession proof.  This business rarely makes anyone wealthy, and almost all of us have pre-conceived notions of what the perfect center is before we opened, and are quickly proved off-target.

What I can tell you that here at iGames is your best chance at making an educated decision.  You don't want to ask your important questions in the "gamer" section.  Most centers won't even respond here.  They are looking for a commitment to the community that membership displays.  In the private area every question you have, has been answered a hundred times over.  If you look through the details you will be able to piece together a plan of attack, and then decide if it is feasible.

It is always important to note where your advice is coming from. 

 
 

ZenWarrior:

ZaCkO:

Also above somewhere, 1200+ for console rig? Hmm are you buying the parts wholesale? Because the computer rig at 1200 is right, but the console... you can get at least 400 dollars (unless you are including the rocker game chair) cheaper even including all the parts you wrote down (newegg). Plus are we forgetting to take into account buying seperate games for each console vs. buying simple licenses for computers. But as some mentioned above, yes it depends on the area. What do the people want? Best to find that out.

One *could* get the computer system for $400 cheaper too, but just like an $800 console system, it would be a POS.

XBox 360 Elite: $400
Cable extensions so you can have the system behind the counter: $50+
Gamepod: $400
LCD: $800+
LCD mounting hardware or stand: $50+

So ummm... actually, a decent console system costs $500 MORE than the PC system.  ;P

hmm 800 for a lcd tv or monitor? What are you buying? It's much cheaper to go hd lcd monitor and just about the same quality to a hd lcd tv. The price you list is outrageous. I am guessing some top brand tv huge inch screen or not even wholesale. Plus your comparing console with gamepod and computer probably not with one. Not all game centers with consoles need a gamepod chair to be successful (although it is nice)... But of course I don't have a game center yet to compare to yours. The rest of your figures seem correct.

I also understand you don't want to post the products used. Can always compare in my inbox ;)

ZaCkO

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Who is your attitude?

ZenWarrior:

Well I would say 90-95% of GC's fail.  98% may be pushing it though... and to characterize the entire industry as destined to failure is inaccurate.  I'm not even close to failure, and I have yet to see a center following my guidelines fail.  I'm guessing you were probably one of the hundreds who thought he could actually make it by throwing 20 computers in a room and charging $4+/hour.  Live and learn... better luck next time.

This is very true. I was never under that assumption myself, but I did come in with a few rules. We live and die by some of our projections at Redhammers. Certain non-gaming aspects of the business suck. Then again, with ZERO advertising (which our first 12 months in this test store was designed to mimic that) we have far exceeded expectations in several other areas including computer time. We have learned several valuable lessons on a much smaller scale that was certainly less costly than going with my major plan.

The next store (and I am in negotiations for the building purchase now) will be done with the help of the bank for the GC side is for a 24 PC's, 24 X-Box units, 12 PS3 units, and 1-2 Wii to start. 80 units are the maximum (I figure) for this area. Purchasing the buildings is a great boon, though one not to be taken lightly (another legal can 'o worms so to speak), but it has distinct benefits. Then again I've had stop and start negotiations with this one company for about 6 months now and am ready to tell them to f**k off in a professional manner.

That being said, I also don't know what happened to Extreme PC (a local competitor) directly. I know that we sure as s**t didn't drive them out of business. I have 16 stations in the current place now and started with just 8. He's got over 30, but they are older. I've been buying my PC's exactly on mark (time wise) or better based on sales. We haven't spent a dime (unplanned) on PC hardware since launch, and no more personal cash from us in particular. We budgeted very carefully. So carefully, in fact, that the GC will be fully paid for in about 16 more months. That includes all of the non-GC specific items too. (Comic racks, comic/card inventories, et al)

Then again, and Caesar did this too, it's a measure twice and cut once. I've learned (and God help me, my partner will either have learned this or I will beat him to a bloody pulp LOL) some very important things about cutting corners to shave a dollar or two, here and there. Truth is, you spend 5 times what you saved in money and gain a whole lot of headaches when you cut a corner. I'm not necessarily talking about the units directly, but more appropriately about the build-out / back-office stuff. 'Tis real easy to focus on the PC's / Consoles and miss the forest for the trees.

Take the time

Do the research

Plan the business

Make sure you have the resources

Adapt as necessary

90% of those that fail were unprepared or too rosy in their predictions. Heck, my predictions were downright evil towards us. 

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Good in theory, lousy in practice - it implies that I'm expendable. I am many things. I am bright, personable, charismatic, and not a bad dancer, but expendable? No.

Lead Technical Operations
Redhammer's G & C

yea great response jderks, there was a computer/gaming shop here that only lasted a year at most. The place had this:

1. Bad location, big shop, wasted space

2. Owner couldn't speak english very good

3. No air conditioning and all windows were bar locked, couldn't see the inside. No air flow, just fans with hot air.

4. Not always open even when his hours listed were open.

5. Website business / hardware sell but the prices and hardware were so old it was a rip (They said they had 20 years of experience, more like 20 months to me).

6. $4 an hour on a computer, no video games, just internet and msn to chat. You could not install anything.

7. Started only doing repair service, got rid of the computers, and selling wireless internet to the community.

8. The repair side was unorganized and parts were left everywhere even on the computer rent side. Imagine coming to get your computer and seeing the parts were everywhere. Easy to damage!

9. Couldn't make the monthly rent and started asking others for help, getting disperate. Tried other things that didn't make money.

Why was he even in business? Obivously he didn't plan a thing! Plus his experience was so low. Probably just had a dream and tried to carry it or moved into the business to try to make money. My dad tried that, you can't turn a chocolate shop into something else. It's a chocolate shop! Plan ahead. Don't change your store. Of course you can do other services or products that are close to your store but not completely apart! He started buying statues and tried reselling them in the shop. Blah! Work with your business.

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Who is your attitude?

ZaCkO:

ZenWarrior:

ZaCkO:

Also above somewhere, 1200+ for console rig? Hmm are you buying the parts wholesale? Because the computer rig at 1200 is right, but the console... you can get at least 400 dollars (unless you are including the rocker game chair) cheaper even including all the parts you wrote down (newegg). Plus are we forgetting to take into account buying seperate games for each console vs. buying simple licenses for computers. But as some mentioned above, yes it depends on the area. What do the people want? Best to find that out.

One *could* get the computer system for $400 cheaper too, but just like an $800 console system, it would be a POS.

XBox 360 Elite: $400
Cable extensions so you can have the system behind the counter: $50+
Gamepod: $400
LCD: $800+
LCD mounting hardware or stand: $50+

So ummm... actually, a decent console system costs $500 MORE than the PC system.  ;P

hmm 800 for a lcd tv or monitor? What are you buying? It's much cheaper to go hd lcd monitor and just about the same quality to a hd lcd tv. The price you list is outrageous. I am guessing some top brand tv huge inch screen or not even wholesale. Plus your comparing console with gamepod and computer probably not with one. Not all game centers with consoles need a gamepod chair to be successful (although it is nice)... But of course I don't have a game center yet to compare to yours. The rest of your figures seem correct.

I also understand you don't want to post the products used. Can always compare in my inbox ;)

ZaCkO

I only have PC's in my current shop, but other GC owners with XBoxes will tell you the same thing.  Most consider the Gamepod essential to success... it makes them standout vs playing at home.  26-32" or so monitors/TV's tend to be popular... need high resolution AND very low latency.  Good 26"-ers (LCD monitors or HD LCD TV's) are around $450-500+.  32"-ers $800+.  Seeing the latency, I would venture that 26" is best, but I'll let the XBox centers/players speak to that.  But even with a cheap chair and a 26" LCD you're still looking at $1k+

Wholesale is a myth.  You will not find wholesale prices any cheaper than a good deal at Sam's Club or CostCo... or hardly any cheaper than NewEgg.  They have huge quantity buy discounts which will always compare to and usually beat your small "wholesale" purchase, even after taking their small profit.

I wish we had more moderators so someone could just go ahead and move this thread out of here.

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Martin "MrFurious" Kruse
Xtreme Gaming Cybercafe
www.goxgaming.com

IGames Community Member Since 2003

MrFurious:

I wish we had more moderators so someone could just go ahead and move this thread out of here.

They are probably busy, I tried to email and apply for membership, no response. So I don't know what's up.

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Who is your attitude?

Very true ZenWarrior. In my opinion, I still wouldn't buy gamepods, I have seen them break easily (wired ones even if cords are hidden), and they just aren't the true gaming experience to me. Most people aren't going to come to your game center just because you have a gamepod chair. They'll come to play with others, socialism. My chairs have to be at least comfy so that they stay. Could buy the wireless gamepods, but expense and other problems, I think it's not for me as well.

But you can't go too wrong with having them. They just add more expense and adjustment in prices. Making sure they always work, repair, well then your ok. But the shops I seen, they don't do that. I guess they don't look at it as a business. Clean up the place. My friends like them, even believe themselves a game center can't make it without them. 

Doesn't make sense to me... if computer stations aren't using them and people still come to play on them... wouldn't you believe you don't need them to succeed for consoles too? It is a little different but consoles are computers also just a little bit more friendly ;)

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Who is your attitude?

You make valid points.  Others who use them say GamePods last a long time, but I would bet they wouldn't last 6 months in my shop.  Our traffic is just too intense.  Comfort and durability/finances are certainly the most important issues to me (comfort being primary of course).  Not sure the vibration is really all that impressive, so you may be right.  I just haven't tested one here to say for sure.  One thing that does bother me is their extra electricity usage for all the vibration, etc.  I believe they have a nice warranty though?  So I dunno... just saying what others have said.  My experience is purely PC systems.  I certainly wouldn't get one of those cheapo console seats that sit low to the ground or look ghetto as hell.  But if it's cheap, looks great, lasts a while, and is just as comfortable then I would certainly entertain the idea.

But as far as treating consoles the same as PC's, well... PC's are usually higher end at a GC, while most home systems are very lacking.  We still use nice executive chairs and we have 22" 2ms LCD monitors.  Consoles on the other hand are cheap computers so you must differentiate yourself on some other fronts.  Certainly socialization and environment are by far the most important factors, but I believe in hitting ALL fronts and paying attention to every detail so the customer has the best experience at a very good price on all fronts... and that means making sure you stand out vs most home systems too.

Yes, of course you and I already know this, we're just helping others :P
Doesn't matter though, I assume this thread will be gone sometime.

Another good point -> My computer station is 4 lcd hd monitors with a quad core processor, 4 gbs of ram, 2 ati hd 3870s, and a lot more stuff. Even though my computer and gaming experience will wipe any one pc station and more, I still prefer to come and play with friends. As long as the price is right and it's comfy. I'm sure other people with a console would do the same. Besides, game centers shouldn't try to buy top of the line stuff to make me come, because if they tried to meet my expectations, well they would be spending too much. Can't satisfy every customer. But you can try most.

Now that I remember it that gaming center here had ghetto chairs also. Haha. Hurt wrist from trying to reach the mouse at a stiff angle.

A different gaming center actually had nice stuff, they even upgraded, but after my second time playing I never paid again. The people there didn't play with anyone, they were just all mmos and played on the internet by themselves. A friend of mine got too addicted and always went there to play mmo, of course he lost his job and lived in his car. Eventually he spent 2000 there and was kicked out from his parents house. So, he had no money to spend again... leech, hmm I know it ruined him, and he won't come back as often. It was more like a casino and I didn't like that at all. Last I heard from him he was borrowing a computer or getting a cheap one so he could play mmo all the time without going to the gaming center. The more times I visited, it was the same, and well that wasn't a gaming center to me. Should change the name to MMO Casino lol.

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Who is your attitude?